Fresh Air is an essential manual on marketing radio stations and the radio industry, by Mark Ramsey. Read the Will it ever be legal to podcast music? An interview with attorney David Oxenford - Part I
David Oxenford is one of the authors of the Broadcast Law Blog and a partner with Davis Wright Tremaine, working in radio broadcasting, media, music, and webcasting.
Today, Part 1.
Coming up...
Part 2: It’s time for Radio to charge labels for airplay – legally
Part 3: Why can’t the Radio industry enter the music business (hint: They can)?
What follows is an abbreviated transcript. I recommend you listen to the audio podcast here for the full impact.
MP3 File
David, when, if ever, will the labels figure out a way to facilitate the process of podcasting music? When will those rights fees issues be worked out?
That’s a big question because it involves not only the labels but also the music publishing companies. And when you put something into a specific on-demand service in a digital world, you’ve got to deal not only with the folks who have created the music, the particular recording of the music, the record labels, the copyrights, and the recording of a particular song, but also with the composers. So there are all sorts of issues in any sort of on-demand service.
Okay, well lots of things are hard, but the first step on a long journey requires that first step. What do you see as the timeline here? Will we ever be able to legally podcast music?
Right now there is no easy clearinghouse, and I really haven’t even heard of anybody talking about setting up one on the label side of things. So if you want to play a particular Dave Matthews song on a podcast and you want to go to some website and pay $2.00, $10.00, $100.00, whatever, to include it in a podcast, there’s nothing like that now or on the horizon. As far as I know, it’s not even being discussed.
Now, there are plenty of services that will provide a clearinghouse for some music, but it’s only the music that they have the rights to. It’s not the entire universe of music like you get through the statutory license when you’re a webcaster.
Well why? Why isn’t it being discussed? If I want to put Red Hot Chili Peppers on a podcast, why isn’t there somebody out there whom I can send my money to? I know there’s a fear that any content in any unprotected digital form is ripe for piracy, but surely you can’t diminish piracy by eliminating legitimate legal access, right?
There’s no question it should be done. Right now, you have to go through each and every record company and negotiate separately for every song, and for the small guy it makes it almost impossible.
Isn’t this an obvious revenue opportunity for the labels?
Yes, I would think it would be.
Then what’s keeping this from happening?
You know, I think it’s inertia. We’re talking about little bits of revenue, you know, and as we all know in the internet world little bits of revenue add up, eventually, to big revenue, but to take the initiative to get the rights to make these songs available in an easy way and set the pricing schedules and to make songs available to podcast or for other on-demand uses, it’s not a simple process. It involves negotiations with the artists, and the composers, so I think the record companies simply haven’t gotten around to it.
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Mark -
Your headline should read "When Will It Be Legal to Podcast LICENSED RIAA music?"
Because it's perfectly legal to podcast music - podsafe music. Lots of mainstream bands are allowing new releases to be played on podcasts - most recently Duran Duran and Black Crowes, plus a plethora of new bands.
--*Rob
Posted by: Rob Usdin | March 12, 2008 at 04:52 AM
Quite right, Rob!
Thanks!
Posted by: Mark Ramsey | March 12, 2008 at 05:29 AM
I will admit that my knee-jerk reaction is much more vehement than Rob's. I've grown tired of music that's created for mass consumption being passed off as music that 'everyone' loves. Let's be honest, we all have different tastes. Somebody likes the top 40 pap that's out there, I just happen to want a more diverse taste. Call it my natural inclination to look for the different. Maybe I'm just deliberately obstinate. All I know is that I want choices beyond what can be offered by radio stations so focused on advertising sales.
I stopped listening to live radio in April 2005. This includes a cross-country, three week drive... no live radio. The music I listen to now comes from the few paid PodCasters and the many independent PodCasters who are sharing their musical tastes. These have ranged from heavy metal to Scottish Folk Rock to French Hip-Hop to Israeli Rock music to American geek rock. I've been able to experience music that I'd never heard before. The music I can hear now is not even available on the late night shows of the local public radio station (WXPN) or the local college radio stations (Princeton or Rutgers). Generally, I'd turn to those niche stations for musical diversity. Thanks to this new exposure of different types of music, my CD collection has grown as I've purchased a LOT of new music.
PodCasting of music is alive and well. This bizarre fetishism to get top 40 legally distributed is, in my humble opinion, a bit offensive to the musicians who already have their music distributed around the world through this new medium.
Posted by: Brad P. from NJ | March 12, 2008 at 07:14 AM
To clarify what I thought was obvious based on the thrust of this blog, I'm talking about the music people hear on the radio, gang.
Posted by: Mark Ramsey | March 12, 2008 at 07:42 AM
wonderful insight. I was asked about the situation recently and now I have most of the answers. Even if the answer is 'not yet' it is good to know where things are at.
To clarify, U2 are Irish and not based in the UK. But for tax reasons they do a lot of tax in Holland not Ireland where artists used to live tax free, but that was recently altered.
Posted by: Brian Greene | March 13, 2008 at 05:41 PM